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Poster: snow_and_rain Date: Aug 13, 2012 9:43am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

I've often heard it said that the spring 1990 tour was the last great tour -- something of a last hurrah before Brent's death and the subsequent decline during the 1990s.

In my opinion there are a number of very strong shows during Brent's final tour. So just what is it that distinguishes the spring tour from the summer tour?

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Poster: craven714 Date: Aug 13, 2012 11:18am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

short answer-
Brent dead
Vince barely alive
Grateful Dead, $ making machine at that point
Bruce held on for as long as he could (bless him)

thats what distinguishes it to me at least

I saw Brent a week before he died, and saw Vince's 2nd
show. You prolly were at the Coliseum too ;)
(one more saturday night)

For me, and I didnt realize it til later: Dare I say...
totally different. There, I said it. Not BAD, just different. Everyone felt it. Im all for silly questions.
Believe you me...

View From the Vault 1 is a fairly good common denominator.
But just fodder when it comes to apples and oranges.

Im glad to be of NO help. Have a nice day :)

cleveland rocks from what I've heard btw.

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Poster: snow_and_rain Date: Aug 13, 2012 11:35am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

The question was Spring vs. Summer, not before and after Brent's death. By fall, I'd certainly felt it too, and I'd only seen the one show at that point. (Though I still think that 9/8/90 -- V's 2nd -- was a pretty kick-ass show.

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Poster: craven714 Date: Aug 14, 2012 7:24am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

OH, my bad. I should read more... sry
no comment ;)

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Poster: Headstrung Date: Aug 13, 2012 7:16pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

I'll be a tweener. I was living in the Pacific North West at the time attending The Evergreen State College and saw the three June Cal-Expo shows and the two Eugene shows. Before this the last run of shows I saw were the 1989 New Years shows and nothing in Spring 1990. Sac-a-tomato and Eugene were better shows then that New Years run and lets face it the Oakland Coliseum sucks.

But to not dodge your question I slightly prefer that Summer run as a whole over the Spring run.

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Poster: wisconsindead Date: Aug 13, 2012 10:25am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

this is a good question and I wish that I have listened to more summer 1990 shows so I could say. Off the top of my head I recall there being a slight change in overall sound of the band that wasn't as full as something like you get from 1990-03-22 which has long been in my rotation. View from the Vault 1 is an example of a show that I was just bored with. It may be the sole reason I've never ventured past march of 1990.

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Poster: snow_and_rain Date: Aug 13, 2012 10:33am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

VFTV 1 may indeed have some cheesy video effects, but I think it's a very solid show -- especially the second set. Also happens to have been my first show, so you should take my opinion with a grain of salt. Still, from Let it Grow onward I think it's a pretty stellar performance.

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Poster: wisconsindead Date: Aug 13, 2012 10:43am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

ill give her another shot. I just recall the sound quality being sub par, a bit thin.

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Poster: snow_and_rain Date: Aug 13, 2012 10:45am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

There's a pretty fantastic AUD for that show...

http://archive.org/details/gd1990-07-08.nak300.holtz.lmpp.97714.sbeok.flac16

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Poster: Deadhead225 Date: Aug 13, 2012 12:27pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: What's the difference between a Frog?

I did both tours. The answer to your question is (Both legs just the same) they were virtually the same in terms of quality of playing. Like the Weir interview says, they were tight and really firing on all cylinders. All the touch head naysayers either missed these shows or are simply sour grapes b/c they could get out there during this time period. The scene was also very enjoyable in 1990. Yeah there were cop scenes, but that just filtered out a lot of fishheads, gave an edged and provided for some good GD stories. It was all about keeping your shit together just enough, which is a good life lesson.

If you have any doubts, listen to the Deer Creek from '90. The Other One>Dew is indicative of their level of playing. The Playin' splice jam in NC was also killer. Pittsburgh was good, but not at the same level as the NC, IN, or DC shows in my opinion. Those all easily compare with Albany, Hartford, Copps, Cap Centre, Atlanta in the spring. Nassau was in a class by itself and might give spring the edge but it is probably the difference between the intensity of indoor shows vs. outdoor shows. Barring a Red Rocks, Greek or Deer Creek type venue, it was just harder to get the ship to the same level outside as in. The key here was that they were employing a lot of new technology, and like the midi or not, they were perfecting it. Some of the new material was not my preference but on these two tours you could actually get a hated Victim that had some redeeming qualities, and THAT is indicative of the level of playing.

I believe that Brent's death dealt a blow to the band that took a long time to really take effect. After all they had just overcome, it was really fatiguing to have to do Europe (already scheduled and marketed) without a key member. I saw all those too, and you could tell they used it as kind of a recovery period and never completely got back to the same level. Some good shows in '91 for sure but never got to the same energy level IMO.

What blew me away was how Brent could have felt at his worst and been doing some of his best playing at the same time. That added to the level of bewilderment that followed.

This post was modified by Deadhead225 on 2012-08-13 19:27:15

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Aug 13, 2012 3:16pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: What's the difference between a Frog?

I had tickets for the Europe minus Sweden. Traded them all away. The band never recovered from Brent's death.

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Poster: user unknown Date: Aug 13, 2012 4:13pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: What's the difference between a Frog?

Don't you mean some(most?) Deadheads never recovered form Brent's death?

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Aug 13, 2012 4:53pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: What's the difference between a Frog?

Yeah Bill, I'll reel that back in a bit to most and change the subject too.

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Poster: user unknown Date: Aug 14, 2012 5:01am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: What's the difference between a Frog?

Hey, there are those who think they never recovered after Pig's death.

This post was modified by user unknown on 2012-08-14 12:01:02

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Poster: SomeDarkHollow Date: Aug 13, 2012 12:51pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: What's the difference between a Frog?

Can't say as I disagree with anything said. Well done.
On a personal level, while the quality of playing may have been at least similar from Spring to Summer, my individual experiences were quite different. In the gigantor general admission stadium shows it seems like I spent as much time trying to remain un-trampled as I did enjoying the music.

While I enjoyed a few of the Vince shows I saw later, the shows in the Spring of 90 were the last ones I left saying "Wow".

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Poster: Deadhead225 Date: Aug 13, 2012 3:42pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: What's the difference between a Frog?

LOL. Knowing most of the venues pretty well and having a lot of good tour luck, was key to those huge places. I found that if you went to the "living room" (on the 2nd level straight back) you nearly always had great sound and room to boogie. This is the best place in RFK for sure. Especially when the deck rocks up and down about 3'. I always wondered if it was engineered for that.

I agree that summer '90 marked the last of the routine 'wow' shows. The following year at Deer Creek was pretty good though along with some of those other summer shows. A good bit was just leftover momentum and good times from so many years of hot shows. Kept me hanging on for a while longer.

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Aug 13, 2012 3:08pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Spring 1990 vs. Summer 1990

I was going to give a slight edge to the spring, but after some research I have to call it a push. I do think Brent slows down a bit as the summer goes on, though there are several huge shows that summer and a high level of consistent playing.